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Old Thursday, February 19th, 2009, 10:46 AM
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Default Ritz Carlton deal signed

I just read that Aruba has signed a deal with Ritz Carlton to build a 5 star hotel just north of the Marriotts. This deal has been in (and out of) the works for several years. In addition to the obvious vote of confidence that this deal shows in the Aruban economy, I also applaud the fact that Ritz Carlton will not be getting any tax holiday.

Here's the complete article:

Ritz Carlton Will Invest A Record US$200 Million On Aruban Property

February 18th 2009, Aruba.



ORANJESTAD-The government has surprized many on the island on Wednesday by announcing the
construction of a five star luxury Ritz Carlton Resort. The present and past governments have for
15 years tried to attract a prestigious five star resort brand such as the Ritz Carlton in Aruba, with
not much success.

With great pride Prime Minister Nelson Oduber announced that the parties involved in the
negotiation of the proposed Ritz Carlton project have reached an agreement, and construction of
the resort will start shortly. The Prime Minister admitted that the road to bring Ritz Carlton to
Aruba was long and difficult, but was pleased with the final outcome.

Aruba's tourism industry has long matured, and it is now time to elevate the quality of the tourism
product to a higher level, by attracting the luxury market and that of high excellence. Contrary to
past hotel projects, it is agreed that the Ritz Carlton hotel will not receive tax holiday from the
government, nor will the government stand guaranteed for the project. This project will not cost
Aruba tax payers money, but will provide money to the government and locals once the resort is
operational.

The hotel will be constructed north of the Marriott Resort on Hadicurari Beach, and it will be named
Aruba Ritz Carlton Resort Spa & Casino. Ritz Carlton Aruba will consist out of 320 rooms of high
quality design consistent with the standards of Ritz Carlton. The construction of the five star hotel
property is priced at US$200 million. Aruba Investment Bank is the biggest financial stakeholder in
the project.

While many hotel projects in the Caribbean are being cancelled because of the present global
financial and economic crisis, the construction of Ritz Carlton in Aruba is a sign of confidence in the
tourism product and the economy of the island. The construction of the hotel is welcome news for
the construction sector, it will provide 425 construction jobs. Ritz Carlton Aruba will employ 500
people once the hotel is operational. An additional 550 indirect jobs will be created because of
additional tourists. Oduber says there is no need to attract much foreign labor, as 900 students
complete their studies each year on the island.

Oduber emphasized that attracting an additional five star hotel on the island does not imply that
Aruba is a five star tourism destination, but it is a step forward in achieving that goal. "We have
to continue to improve our tourism product, through educating and motivating employees working
in the sector, and hotels should improve and upgrade their facilities." The government will continue
to push for the relocation of the container terminal from Oranjestad to Barcadera, and soon
announce the start of revitalizing the main street of Oranjestad.
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Last edited by charlierat; Thursday, February 19th, 2009 at 04:38 PM.
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Old Thursday, February 19th, 2009, 11:07 AM
mleajanko mleajanko is offline
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

UGH more congestion on this island - I may have to rethink my vacation location in the future. As a member of a Marriott timeshare that area is already over crowded!
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Old Thursday, February 19th, 2009, 01:06 PM
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I Love Aruba Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Not that I'll rethink my vacation at this point, but I agree - enough already!!
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Old Thursday, February 19th, 2009, 01:36 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

I cant afford the Hyatt or Radisson so I guess it will be another hotel on the island I cant afford. Wonder what will happen to the wind surfers?
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Old Thursday, February 19th, 2009, 02:14 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

The Ritz was nixed a few years ago because of the issue of the hotel cutting off the winds from the wind surfers. Then they published something after that of a hotel that was designed to be low that was going to be done by some Arubians.

The govt is trying to get all the money they can before they are voted out this Sept!
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Old Thursday, February 19th, 2009, 07:14 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Is this going to be timeshare? i remember when I purchased my Marriott surf club timeshare, they were mentioning that because the Marriott owns the Ritz they were going to strt the Ritz as soon as they finished selling the Surf Club. He mentioned $500,000.00 for 3 weeks timeshare.

Anybody hae any feedback.
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Old Thursday, February 19th, 2009, 08:34 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Looks like not everybody is happy....
(in Papiamento)


Ritz Carlton mester bin Aruba aunke turismo ta cay
RAINBOW WARRIORS CU BOYCOT INTERNACIONAL CONTRA RITZ CARLTON
*Accion straño di Gobierno por provoca boycot Marriott
*Marisol mester splica kico tin den e asunto aki
ORANJESTAD (AAN) — Mientras turismo di Aruba ta bini abao y hasta mester a hinca 10 Miyon di placa di Plant den un plan pa trata di atrae turista pa Aruba, Gobierno den un acto sorprendente ayera a reuni cu Marriott pa firma un contrato pa construccion di Ritz Carlton, manera DIARIO a anuncia for di Dialuna. E acto aki ta haltamente cuestiona den circulonan hotelero, cu sa cu na e momento aki mester di consolidacion di turismo.
Uno di e preguntanan grandi cu ta haci den mundo di turismo e dianan aki ta, kico a pasa cu diripiente Ritz Carlton a bolbe subi tereno. Aña pasa tabata tin un incidente serio den seno di Conseho di ministronan encuanto e tereno caminda Ritz Carlton lo a aparece. E tereno aki lo mester a bay pa un financiador di MEP.
A surgi problemanan serio den seno di Gobierno, loke a haci cu hasta tabata tin menaza cu “tur hende lo por a bay cera”. Esaki tabata e tabla di Marisol ora Thijsen kier a actua contra Marisol den Conseho di ministronan. E asunto nunca a haya aclareaccion.
Awor cu turismo ta den un crisis, diripiente e proyecto Ritz Carlton ta bini. Un acto sorprendente, special pa e grupo Rainbow Warriors cu den pasado a adverti Marriott y Ritz Carlton cu e lo actua cu un boycot internacional contra propiedadnan selecta di Ritz Carlton rond mundo.
Ayeranochi un comunicado a mira luz di Rainbow Warriors, cu a anuncia cu nan ta contempla un boycot internacional contra Marriot tambe.
Dialuna otro grupo di ciudadano cu ta observa proyectonan straño, a publica un advertencia na Marriott den DIARIO, cu ta sigui investiga e caso aki.
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Old Thursday, February 19th, 2009, 08:49 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

looks like sandra or localisa needs to do some translating tomorrow.

Quote:
Originally Posted by qlaval View Post
Looks like not everybody is happy....

(in Papiamento)


Ritz Carlton mester bin Aruba aunke turismo ta cay
RAINBOW WARRIORS CU BOYCOT INTERNACIONAL CONTRA RITZ CARLTON
*Accion straño di Gobierno por provoca boycot Marriott
*Marisol mester splica kico tin den e asunto aki
ORANJESTAD (AAN) — Mientras turismo di Aruba ta bini abao y hasta mester a hinca 10 Miyon di placa di Plant den un plan pa trata di atrae turista pa Aruba, Gobierno den un acto sorprendente ayera a reuni cu Marriott pa firma un contrato pa construccion di Ritz Carlton, manera DIARIO a anuncia for di Dialuna. E acto aki ta haltamente cuestiona den circulonan hotelero, cu sa cu na e momento aki mester di consolidacion di turismo.
Uno di e preguntanan grandi cu ta haci den mundo di turismo e dianan aki ta, kico a pasa cu diripiente Ritz Carlton a bolbe subi tereno. Aña pasa tabata tin un incidente serio den seno di Conseho di ministronan encuanto e tereno caminda Ritz Carlton lo a aparece. E tereno aki lo mester a bay pa un financiador di MEP.
A surgi problemanan serio den seno di Gobierno, loke a haci cu hasta tabata tin menaza cu “tur hende lo por a bay cera”. Esaki tabata e tabla di Marisol ora Thijsen kier a actua contra Marisol den Conseho di ministronan. E asunto nunca a haya aclareaccion.
Awor cu turismo ta den un crisis, diripiente e proyecto Ritz Carlton ta bini. Un acto sorprendente, special pa e grupo Rainbow Warriors cu den pasado a adverti Marriott y Ritz Carlton cu e lo actua cu un boycot internacional contra propiedadnan selecta di Ritz Carlton rond mundo.
Ayeranochi un comunicado a mira luz di Rainbow Warriors, cu a anuncia cu nan ta contempla un boycot internacional contra Marriot tambe.

Dialuna otro grupo di ciudadano cu ta observa proyectonan straño, a publica un advertencia na Marriott den DIARIO, cu ta sigui investiga e caso aki.
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Old Thursday, February 19th, 2009, 09:20 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Does it seems a bit surreal that a five star luxury hotel is being built in a time of global recession on an island with already empty rooms? Perhaps the Ritz people know something about the recession that nobody else is aware of?
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 01:24 AM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

They probably don't have to borrow the money.... plus
the project won't be finished before a few years probably just after the recession...
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 04:11 AM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

I'm not going to translate the whole thing, but it comes down to the Rainbow warriors (environmental group) is going to boycott the RC. Minister Marisol has to explain what she has to do with this (she's the minister of environmental ordening).
While tourism is on a decline and the government has to pay 10 million for the whole Plant deal, they did an amazing thing and sign a contract for construction of the RC. They are questioning how come the RC all of a sudden has resurfaced while tourism worldwide in general and on Aruba specifically is on a decline.
All in all they are questioning the governments motives and they are questioning RC's motives. They have issued a statement that they are contemplating a boycott. They will investigate this case more and inform everyone about their findings.

That's it in a nutshell.




Quote:
Originally Posted by qlaval View Post
Looks like not everybody is happy....

(in Papiamento)


Ritz Carlton mester bin Aruba aunke turismo ta cay
RAINBOW WARRIORS CU BOYCOT INTERNACIONAL CONTRA RITZ CARLTON
*Accion straño di Gobierno por provoca boycot Marriott
*Marisol mester splica kico tin den e asunto aki
ORANJESTAD (AAN) — Mientras turismo di Aruba ta bini abao y hasta mester a hinca 10 Miyon di placa di Plant den un plan pa trata di atrae turista pa Aruba, Gobierno den un acto sorprendente ayera a reuni cu Marriott pa firma un contrato pa construccion di Ritz Carlton, manera DIARIO a anuncia for di Dialuna. E acto aki ta haltamente cuestiona den circulonan hotelero, cu sa cu na e momento aki mester di consolidacion di turismo.
Uno di e preguntanan grandi cu ta haci den mundo di turismo e dianan aki ta, kico a pasa cu diripiente Ritz Carlton a bolbe subi tereno. Aña pasa tabata tin un incidente serio den seno di Conseho di ministronan encuanto e tereno caminda Ritz Carlton lo a aparece. E tereno aki lo mester a bay pa un financiador di MEP.
A surgi problemanan serio den seno di Gobierno, loke a haci cu hasta tabata tin menaza cu “tur hende lo por a bay cera”. Esaki tabata e tabla di Marisol ora Thijsen kier a actua contra Marisol den Conseho di ministronan. E asunto nunca a haya aclareaccion.
Awor cu turismo ta den un crisis, diripiente e proyecto Ritz Carlton ta bini. Un acto sorprendente, special pa e grupo Rainbow Warriors cu den pasado a adverti Marriott y Ritz Carlton cu e lo actua cu un boycot internacional contra propiedadnan selecta di Ritz Carlton rond mundo.
Ayeranochi un comunicado a mira luz di Rainbow Warriors, cu a anuncia cu nan ta contempla un boycot internacional contra Marriot tambe.

Dialuna otro grupo di ciudadano cu ta observa proyectonan straño, a publica un advertencia na Marriott den DIARIO, cu ta sigui investiga e caso aki.
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 08:49 AM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

So the Rainbow Warriors aren't concerned about the environmental impact; they just don't think that this was a good economic deal. Did I read that correctly?

I know I'm in a small minority on this one but I am excited about the project. (But, then again, I kind of like the Riu, too.)
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 09:15 AM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

As far as I can tell it isn't the windsurfers beach area - instead it is (according to the paper) Hardicurari (sp?)/Basiruti. That, according to the map is in between the HI and the Marriott - WOW! When we were at Moomba's all we could do was marvel at how many people were on the HI and Marriott beaches - now more. It says the RC is going to be a hotel just like all the other ones.
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 09:22 AM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Quote:
Originally Posted by Linda VH View Post
As far as I can tell it isn't the windsurfers beach area - instead it is (according to the paper) Hardicurari (sp?)/Basiruti. That, according to the map is in between the HI and the Marriott - WOW! When we were at Moomba's all we could do was marvel at how many people were on the HI and Marriott beaches - now more. It says the RC is going to be a hotel just like all the other ones.
It's my understanding that the proposed site is on the south end of Hadicurari Beach, north of the Marriotts.
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 09:54 AM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Quote:
Originally Posted by charlierat View Post
It's my understanding that the proposed site is on the south end of Hadicurari Beach, north of the Marriotts.
That is right and that is the windsurfing area.

As for the rainbow warriors, first they were protesting the RC because of environmental issues and now they've added the fact that hotels have a 40% occupancy rate and don't really see the need for more hotels (with all consequent influences to the island).

I for one would not like to see a new hotel and I think the RIU is a monstrousity.
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 10:50 AM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

I have to try to get to their site - but I know the rainbow warriors site was actually blocked from viewing in Aruba.

Anyone know the URL so I can check again.
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 10:56 AM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Quote:
Originally Posted by lizzardo View Post
I have to try to get to their site - but I know the rainbow warriors site was actually blocked from viewing in Aruba.

Anyone know the URL so I can check again.
here you are: Rainbow Warriors International English Home Page-Aruba
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 10:56 AM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

interesting article in the amigoe today

Ritz-Carlton first five-star hotel
19 Feb, 2009, 08:37 (GMT -04:00)

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Bill Marriot shakes hands with Prime Minister Nelson Oduber after the plans for the five star Ritz-Carlton in Aruba became definate. ORANJESTAD – After four years of negotiations, the Aruban government has finally her first five-star hotel, The Ritz-Carlton. The hotel with 320 rooms will come next to the Marriott resort that is also the parent company of this luxurious hotel chain. The 360 million florins investment is officially done by the Venezuelan group Desarrollos Hotelco S.A. that turned out to be the best from a public tender.
Bill Marriott, project puller Walter Stipa of the investment group, Premier Nelson Oduber, Finance-minister Nilo Swaen, and Tourism-minister Edison Briesen gathered in the Marriott-hotel to celebrate the agreement. It was a big party for especially Aruba; the island has been trying for more than 15 years to bring in a five-star hotel. However, investors pulled out or never came with sufficient money at the end. The Oduber-cabinet decided after criticism from the opposition and the business life, to start a public tender in 2007. Especially because governments of a different colour (AVP) have caused big financial problems in the past, by giving guarantees and tax exemptions to hotels.
A committee considered the plans of the Venezuelan investment group/Marriott as the best during a tender. The hotel will have to rise now on the popular beach of the Fisherman’s Huts.
The Oduber government has received a lot of criticism in the past years for wanting to build a new hotel on this beach. The Chamber of Commerce, employers’ association, and also experts inside the government had pointed the government out on several studies and reports that Aruba has a lot of mass hotels like this one. Besides, they do not deliver the desired high-quality employment, but only more cheap workers from abroad. The infrastructure is also no longer adequate for this.
Also the environmental movement is very much worried about the consequences for the protected turtle species that nest on the Fisherman’s Huts every year. The movement says that very little attention is given to environmental protection. At least three hundred meter free beach will be gone if the new hotel comes.
Premier Oduber says that the hotel project is part of the economic diversification policy of the government to attract wealthier tourists to Aruba. He is extra proud of the fact that in this economic difficult time, they still managed to bring in such huge investment.
“Aruba needs construction work”, says Oduber as a result of the signals that also the building sector is already suffering under the crisis. “We can sit down and deliberate, but the answer is construction work. We can’t have the aspiration and pretention like the rich countries that can invest millions of tax money as economic way out. Our means are too limited for that.” The premier hopes that the stimulation package of the American president Barack Obama will pay off in Aruba.
Boycot
The first action group has already started with protests against the build of the five-star hotel. Rainbow Warriors threatens with a worldwide boycott of Marriott and all her chains. The movement has been writing letters to The Ritz Carlton to ask attention for the environmental problem. The hotel chain has answered Rainbow in 2006, stating that with all the projects, they try to avoid damaging effects for the environment
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 02:32 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

You're right on the money Dogwriter! Same thing in the states with all the commercial building in the last few years. But, you will be able to get a place in Dubai on the cheap soon

quote=Dogwriter;86735]Does it seems a bit surreal that a five star luxury hotel is being built in a time of global recession on an island with already empty rooms? Perhaps the Ritz people know something about the recession that nobody else is aware of?[/quote]
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 02:36 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed


The yellow stipple line indicates the construction lot for Ritz Carlton Aruba,
the red stipple line the rearranged road towards Westpunt.
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 02:51 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Hmmmmmn....
Marriot Resort and Casino
Marriot Surf Club
Marriot Ocean Club
Marriot Renaissance
Marriot Ritz-Carlton
Marriot Renaissance Island......
Marriot-Aruba?
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 06:24 PM
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I Love Aruba Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

The traffic and parking up by the high rises is absolutely awful! The last thing this island needs is yet another hotel! Condos being built are standing like skeletons, and are eye sores.

I'd sure like to know who's in charge of the overbuilding, and whose pockets are being lined because it has to be people with no common sense. Why no one sees that they're killing this island is beyond me! When and why was the moritorium lifted? This is all without a doubt insane!

Instead of revamping and renovating Oranjestad to bring it back to life, they're building and building an area up that needs no building. Unreal, just unreal and sad.
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 06:26 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Quote:
Originally Posted by lizzardo View Post
interesting article in the amigoe today

Ritz-Carlton first five-star hotel
19 Feb, 2009, 08:37 (GMT -04:00)

Email dit artikel
Print dit artikel
Bill Marriot shakes hands with Prime Minister Nelson Oduber after the plans for the five star Ritz-Carlton in Aruba became definate. ORANJESTAD – After four years of negotiations, the Aruban government has finally her first five-star hotel, The Ritz-Carlton. The hotel with 320 rooms will come next to the Marriott resort that is also the parent company of this luxurious hotel chain. The 360 million florins investment is officially done by the Venezuelan group Desarrollos Hotelco S.A. that turned out to be the best from a public tender.
Bill Marriott, project puller Walter Stipa of the investment group, Premier Nelson Oduber, Finance-minister Nilo Swaen, and Tourism-minister Edison Briesen gathered in the Marriott-hotel to celebrate the agreement. It was a big party for especially Aruba; the island has been trying for more than 15 years to bring in a five-star hotel. However, investors pulled out or never came with sufficient money at the end. The Oduber-cabinet decided after criticism from the opposition and the business life, to start a public tender in 2007. Especially because governments of a different colour (AVP) have caused big financial problems in the past, by giving guarantees and tax exemptions to hotels.
A committee considered the plans of the Venezuelan investment group/Marriott as the best during a tender. The hotel will have to rise now on the popular beach of the Fisherman’s Huts.
The Oduber government has received a lot of criticism in the past years for wanting to build a new hotel on this beach. The Chamber of Commerce, employers’ association, and also experts inside the government had pointed the government out on several studies and reports that Aruba has a lot of mass hotels like this one. Besides, they do not deliver the desired high-quality employment, but only more cheap workers from abroad. The infrastructure is also no longer adequate for this.
Also the environmental movement is very much worried about the consequences for the protected turtle species that nest on the Fisherman’s Huts every year. The movement says that very little attention is given to environmental protection. At least three hundred meter free beach will be gone if the new hotel comes.
Premier Oduber says that the hotel project is part of the economic diversification policy of the government to attract wealthier tourists to Aruba. He is extra proud of the fact that in this economic difficult time, they still managed to bring in such huge investment.
“Aruba needs construction work”, says Oduber as a result of the signals that also the building sector is already suffering under the crisis. “We can sit down and deliberate, but the answer is construction work. We can’t have the aspiration and pretention like the rich countries that can invest millions of tax money as economic way out. Our means are too limited for that.” The premier hopes that the stimulation package of the American president Barack Obama will pay off in Aruba.
Boycot
The first action group has already started with protests against the build of the five-star hotel. Rainbow Warriors threatens with a worldwide boycott of Marriott and all her chains. The movement has been writing letters to The Ritz Carlton to ask attention for the environmental problem. The hotel chain has answered Rainbow in 2006, stating that with all the projects, they try to avoid damaging effects for the environment
Rainbow Warriors International will call for a boycott as announced in 2004-2006 to (then) legal counsel Karen Grubber, and staff members Stephanie Platt and Susan Levenson at Marriott Group/Ritz Carlton.

In correspondence with the Ritz-Carlton though official faxes to legal counsel conditions were stipulated under which circumstances the boycott would be called and these were acknowledged by Ritz-Carlton.

They opted to ignore and heed Mr. Nelson Oduber's counsel on the matter.

Maybe Marriott/Ritz Carlton should check our track record on boycotts (Sol Melia at X'Cacel, British Nuclear Fuels plutonium shipments stopped with kind assistance of Bono Vox-U2 on our personal request, Dolphin slaughter at Paria peninsula in Venezuela, which caused prolongation for 1 year of US embargo of Venezuelan tuna, etc.)

Why the boycott? Because Ritz-Carlton chose to walk the path they would not even dream of in the USA, deliberately ignoring stakeholders.

No impact studies whatsoever were ever made or contemplated!

Stay tuned for new web site of Rainbow Warriors Aruba, not at the outdated link provided earlier.

Milton Ponson, president
Rainbow Warriors Core Foundation (Rainbow Warriors International)
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 07:03 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

first it was the fast food restaurants,now every inch of aruba will be hotels.maybe i sould stay in the usa .if thats what you what.i like the taste of the caribbean,thats why i go there,to try something different. if you like the same old same old florida maybe your cup of tea.year after year that poor island changes,crime,overbuilding,fast food joints.its sad.i own a home near the light house and stay there all the time ,walk across the street to the beach and back.but i still love aruba.the goverment sucks
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 08:05 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Interesting - I can get the splash page for rainbow warriors but every link
says document not found. Wonder if that's coming from Setar or their site
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 08:16 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

I can see the whole site, Liz
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 08:42 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

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Originally Posted by lizzardo View Post
Interesting - I can get the splash page for rainbow warriors but every link
says document not found. Wonder if that's coming from Setar or their site
I can see the link I put up earlier just fine, so we can rule out that it's the link or the site is wired wrong.
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 09:10 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

I don't mean to be repetitive, so if I've said this on this board, I apologize.
If I won the lottery this week, I would NOT be interested in Marriottville, the Aqua development or this new Ritz-Carlton area.
To my simple mind, it is TOO much development for TOO little space.
(I was wondering from the pictures if the windsurfers were being forced out...I guess the answer is YES.)
Just my personal opinion. And if I say we've been going to the low-rise area for 20 years, I'm sure some will say I'm prejudiced.
Yep, I AM!

Last edited by JohnJT; Friday, February 20th, 2009 at 09:11 PM. Reason: ADDED COMMENT
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Old Friday, February 20th, 2009, 10:38 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

sandra, the home page is fine but any link from the home page doesn't function. hope they send a better link so i can read it.

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I can see the link I put up earlier just fine, so we can rule out that it's the link or the site is wired wrong.
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Old Saturday, February 21st, 2009, 10:00 AM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

The windsurfers will absolutely be impacted. They did a study of the winds and had it shown by the surfers huts. Last time I was there - they still had them up. I LOVE watching the windsurfers and would be a loss for this part of the island! Plus kill some tourist revenue to boot!
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnJT View Post
I don't mean to be repetitive, so if I've said this on this board, I apologize.
If I won the lottery this week, I would NOT be interested in Marriottville, the Aqua development or this new Ritz-Carlton area.
To my simple mind, it is TOO much development for TOO little space.
(I was wondering from the pictures if the windsurfers were being forced out...I guess the answer is YES.)
Just my personal opinion. And if I say we've been going to the low-rise area for 20 years, I'm sure some will say I'm prejudiced.
Yep, I AM!

I think there is a lot of prejudice on this board for the low rise section. We own at the Marriott and enjoy it there as well as all of the activity on Palm Beach. We prefer it over Eagle Beach. Yet time and time again on this board I have to see bashing against "Marriottville" etc. I don't see people bashing the low-risers. OK Everyone, I get it you like peace and quiet on Eagle Beach and don't want anyone to build near you. We all have major investments in our timeshares whether you are on Eagle or Palm Beach so can we all be a little more respectful that to each their own preference.
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 11:43 AM
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weimaraner,

hate to say it but you are wrong. people express opinions. as long as they are not bashing people and are only talking about what they dislike in locations, that isn't a lack of respect. that is just honest opinions and are more than accepted on any forum i have ever dealt with.

if they tell someone that they are stupid for liking something, then then are going to get their little behinds bleeped, a personal message from yours truly, and a warning about their future on our forum.

on that note, i have no problem with the high rise area per se. i have stayed at the hyatt, the phoenix, the holiday inn and a few other places in that area. i do prefer the low rise section because i hate crowds. i also hate over building and in my opinion the high rise area has now been overbuilt. that doesn't make you wrong for liking it but neither does it make me wrong for disliking what it has become.

i stopped staying there when i had problems every day getting shade on the beach. i personally don't like the idea of being outside early to stand in line for cover. others think of it as a chance to meet people. i don't. i think of it as a way to ruin my morning coffee on my balcony. however, i also like the lazy river, the calmer seas and being able to walk to many restaurants instead of driving. still, given the option for my vacation time, i will take the peace and quiet of the low rise area.

i will, in my normal fashion of honesty, say that enough is enough with building. they can't fill the rooms with an world wide recession so why are they building more? again, this is my opinion and if we tell people they can't voice opinions then what is the sense of having a forum at all?

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Originally Posted by Weimaraner View Post
I think there is a lot of prejudice on this board for the low rise section. We own at the Marriott and enjoy it there as well as all of the activity on Palm Beach. We prefer it over Eagle Beach. Yet time and time again on this board I have to see bashing against "Marriottville" etc. I don't see people bashing the low-risers. OK Everyone, I get it you like peace and quiet on Eagle Beach and don't want anyone to build near you. We all have major investments in our timeshares whether you are on Eagle or Palm Beach so can we all be a little more respectful that to each their own preference.
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 12:08 PM
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weimaraner,

hate to say it but you are wrong. people express opinions. as long as they are not bashing people and are only talking about what they dislike in locations, that isn't a lack of respect. that is just honest opinions and are more than accepted on any forum i have ever dealt with.

if they tell someone that they are stupid for liking something, then then are going to get their little behinds bleeped, a personal message from yours truly, and a warning about their future on our forum.

on that note, i have no problem with the high rise area per se. i have stayed at the hyatt, the phoenix, the holiday inn and a few other places in that area. i do prefer the low rise section because i hate crowds. i also hate over building and in my opinion the high rise area has now been overbuilt. that doesn't make you wrong for liking it but neither does it make me wrong for disliking what it has become.

i stopped staying there when i had problems every day getting shade on the beach. i personally don't like the idea of being outside early to stand in line for cover. others think of it as a chance to meet people. i don't. i think of it as a way to ruin my morning coffee on my balcony. however, i also like the lazy river, the calmer seas and being able to walk to many restaurants instead of driving. still, given the option for my vacation time, i will take the peace and quiet of the low rise area.

i will, in my normal fashion of honesty, say that enough is enough with building. they can't fill the rooms with an world wide recession so why are they building more? again, this is my opinion and if we tell people they can't voice opinions then what is the sense of having a forum at all?
Thank you for correcting me All I'm saying is that there sure are a lot of low risers on this board. There is a continuous trend of beating up on the high rise area. And I don't think using the term "Marriottville" is respectful. Maybe one of the reasons that people don't feel so welcome here anymore and posts are dwindling.

Last edited by Weimaraner; Sunday, February 22nd, 2009 at 12:16 PM.
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 12:25 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

it would be a shame if people don't feel welcome here and i have no understanding why that would ever happen. do we need to have separate high rise and low rise forums? honestly, it makes no sense to me that all opinions wouldn't be welcome. that's what these forums are all about. variety is the spice of life. if you have an opinion, it is welcome on this board. if someone has a different opinion, that is also welcome. it is senseless to have a forum that is lopsided because people foolishly think their opinions aren't welcome or needed.

bring your friends here. let them voice differing opinions. that's what we are about. as to bashing, that is not what we are about. my best friend in off forum life owns at marriott and phoenix. they love the crowds. that hasn't stopped us from being best friends for over 30 years.

we have a wonderful group of people here who love different places, restaurants, car rentals, beaches, casinos and even politics. we voice opinions. that is the fun of life which i would consider very boring if we didn't have differences.

it would be a shame if people back away from a forum because it's majority opinions differ or they take a comment about a place as an insult because it disagrees with theirs. instead, what should be happening is that the different opinions come together to speak their minds and explain their views.

put bluntly, if you don't say it no one can learn from you. the fact that your smilie is a zippered mouth is upsetting. you are not supposed to be shut up. you are supposed to just understand that people view all of life in different ways. all opinions are valued as long as they don't go into name calling. nothing less will be accepted here and i encourage those with differing opinions to please join us and state those opinions.

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Originally Posted by Weimaraner View Post
Thank you for correcting me All I'm saying is that there sure are a lot of low risers on this board. There is a continuous trend of beating up on the high rise area. Maybe one of the reasons that people don't feel so welcome here anymore.
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 01:09 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

It seems with all the Marriot money on the island, that corporation is able to wield much more clout than a small, relatively independant group could ever hope for. Governments know who is buttering their bread and it is easy to see that in Aruba. Could a smaller, less influential name get that area? Whatever happened to Melia development of the old Bushiri? That would have helped rebuild and existing property without adding to an already crowded area.
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 01:33 PM
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well, walt, the way i see it is that although i agree with you, the problem isn't the tourists or what they want. tourists come to the island. many times it is their first trip. they see the name marriott on a property that they already fell in love with. marriott is well known and international. it gives a feeling of security. people wouldn't buy it if they didn't love it. it is a vacation. we leave ecology at the airport in our home state and think about other things. we think about vacation and a chance to be somewhere that we don't have to worry about what is happening. i don't necessarily think that is wrong. it sort of goes with that famous movie line: 'if you build it they will come'. the reverse doesn't hold true. if you come, they will not necessarily build it. if that was true, aruba would probably look a lot different than it does now, lol.

so, although i am not a fan of marriott and its power, i don't begrudge people buying there and loving it. they are as entitled to as we are to love other places on the island. the point being, it is a vacation and lord knows we all need them. we want the comfort level than many don't get at home. they want a place to stay that they love. most important they come to aruba with different expectations.

i suppose what i mean is bash the builder, not the tourist. the only thing the tourists are doing is living a dream that they worked very hard to realize.

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It seems with all the Marriot money on the island, that corporation is able to wield much more clout than a small, relatively independant group could ever hope for. Governments know who is buttering their bread and it is easy to see that in Aruba. Could a smaller, less influential name get that area? Whatever happened to Melia development of the old Bushiri? That would have helped rebuild and existing property without adding to an already crowded area.
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 01:42 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Sherry,
Could not agree more. Bash the builder, not the buyer. (But stop buying the government.) Would like to see other companies do things with other parts of Aruba. Would love to see from Bushiri south developed toward town. Spread out the congestion. Expand if necessary, but do it in a gentler way.
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 01:52 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

walt, we agree on many things including this. i see many things wrong with most of the timeshares and many of the hotels in aruba but i see those same problems everywhere there is tourism. i see problems with my own timeshare.

maybe that is why i rant about the bucuti so often. they have done it right. that gentle approach. no overcrowding. even when they expanded they didn't overcrowd. they do everything ecologically soundly. they leave the trees up and the huts not crowded. they even picked their lighting to keep the place healthier for clients.

i would love to see more places built with those things in mind. that i would have no problem with. but i never bash the tourists for loving what they are given. i just differ in my views with some of them. i always remember that we all go home to tough lives.

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Sherry,
Could not agree more. Bash the builder, not the buyer. (But stop buying the government.) Would like to see other companies do things with other parts of Aruba. Would love to see from Bushiri south developed toward town. Spread out the congestion. Expand if necessary, but do it in a gentler way.

Last edited by dwippies; Sunday, February 22nd, 2009 at 02:42 PM.
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 02:07 PM
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I Love Aruba Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Hey Weimaraner, you are not the only High-Riser out here! We own at the Marriott Surf Club too, and we bought there for a couple of reasons. First, we have fairly young kids and there is plenty to do there for them. The pools and the lazy river will be great - I am hoping the kids will actually get tired and sleep at night! Second, Marriott properties are generally pretty well kept-up (which is not to say that others aren't), plus it is a company that will be around for (at least) the rest of our lives. Marriott is fairly dependable and predicable (which can be good and bad, I know). Third, we like being near the Paseo Herencia and the restaurants at that end of the island. Fourth, we liked the idea of the trade out value...the last two years we have traded-out the two-bedroom portion of our week and taken the kids to Disney World, and then used the "lock-off" portion for a Mommy-Daddy trip to Aruba. Plus, that way we get two weeks for the price of one. And it gives us options if we can't afford to get all four of us to Aruba - which we can't always do, given the ridiculous airfare from Iowa.

In all fairness, we have never stayed in the low-rise area, we've only stayed at the Renaissance and the Surf Club. I have also never been to the Surf Club during Spring Break, so I reserve the right to change my opinion on things after that experience. (ha ha)

I absolutely agree that it makes no sense whatsoever to build another super-expensive hotel facility in this economy and on this island. However, one of the unfortunate things about our world is that those with the money often wield the power. I don't know whether the Ritz property means that Marriott has that much power or whether they can just afford to build in Aruba. Either way, I am not sure it is a sound investment, but that's not my decision.
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 02:15 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

very well said. you actually echoed the reasons i just stated for those who buy at the marriott. logical good reasons. plus the place has good restaurants and a really nice casino.

you really ought to add a few days to your vacation and try the low rise area. it isn't better. it's just different. i have often stayed at both areas during the same trip to have both experiences. i usually end in the low rise so i can be refreshed at the end of my vacation. it does give those who love big cities but sometimes yearn for country life the variety needed. i truly believe that those that bash one or the other should make sure they bash from experience rather than guess work. try both parts of the island. it's good for the economy and good for the life lesson.

btw, the lazy river makes most kids sleep well. it does the same for adults. we loved it. we slept well, lol.

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Originally Posted by lmccollom View Post
Hey Weimaraner, you are not the only High-Riser out here! We own at the Marriott Surf Club too, and we bought there for a couple of reasons. First, we have fairly young kids and there is plenty to do there for them. The pools and the lazy river will be great - I am hoping the kids will actually get tired and sleep at night! Second, Marriott properties are generally pretty well kept-up (which is not to say that others aren't), plus it is a company that will be around for (at least) the rest of our lives. Marriott is fairly dependable and predicable (which can be good and bad, I know). Third, we like being near the Paseo Herencia and the restaurants at that end of the island. Fourth, we liked the idea of the trade out value...the last two years we have traded-out the two-bedroom portion of our week and taken the kids to Disney World, and then used the "lock-off" portion for a Mommy-Daddy trip to Aruba. Plus, that way we get two weeks for the price of one. And it gives us options if we can't afford to get all four of us to Aruba - which we can't always do, given the ridiculous airfare from Iowa.

In all fairness, we have never stayed in the low-rise area, we've only stayed at the Renaissance and the Surf Club. I have also never been to the Surf Club during Spring Break, so I reserve the right to change my opinion on things after that experience. (ha ha)

I absolutely agree that it makes no sense whatsoever to build another super-expensive hotel facility in this economy and on this island. However, one of the unfortunate things about our world is that those with the money often wield the power. I don't know whether the Ritz property means that Marriott has that much power or whether they can just afford to build in Aruba. Either way, I am not sure it is a sound investment, but that's not my decision.
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 02:25 PM
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I Love Aruba Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

I was typing and I didn't get to see your reply until I posted mine, so sorry for being duplicative. I would love to try the low-rise area. Maybe we can try to do that this fall, without the kids. Where do you recommend? I am all about the life lesson of vacation - especially if there is a good spa involved!

We will see about the lazy river - I can't handle those for too long, as I get motion sick (also why I don't go on cruises - lol). I think the girls will have a great time, and I know that the slides will be a hit as well. I, of course, am looking forward to the swim-up bar and the spa.
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 03:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Weimaraner View Post
I think there is a lot of prejudice on this board for the low rise section. We own at the Marriott and enjoy it there as well as all of the activity on Palm Beach. We prefer it over Eagle Beach. Yet time and time again on this board I have to see bashing against "Marriottville" etc. I don't see people bashing the low-risers. OK Everyone, I get it you like peace and quiet on Eagle Beach and don't want anyone to build near you. We all have major investments in our timeshares whether you are on Eagle or Palm Beach so can we all be a little more respectful that to each their own preference.

I have to admit that I totally agree with what Weimaraner wrote. From the time I joined this board people would constantly (ok, I won't say bash) put down the hi rise area. I own at both the Ocean Club and Surf Club. I love the Marriott properties. I love Palm Beach. I would never post anything negative about the low rise area because I really don't care where other people stay. However, the people who do stay in the low rise are always the first to put down the hi rise. It's true, just go back and check previous posts. This has always irritated me. This is why I really don't have much to do with this board anymore.
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 04:23 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

if you want a hotel, i would recommend the bucuti. if you want dutch style i would say amsterdam manor but the smallest room really is extremely small. for a timeshare, abc is great for a studio or one bedroom. costa linda and and cdm are nice for two bedroom. all but amsterdam manor are beach front and am is right across the street from their beach.

the others i really know little about since i haven't stayed at or visited them so i can't voice my opinion on them with accuracy.

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I was typing and I didn't get to see your reply until I posted mine, so sorry for being duplicative. I would love to try the low-rise area. Maybe we can try to do that this fall, without the kids. Where do you recommend? I am all about the life lesson of vacation - especially if there is a good spa involved!

We will see about the lazy river - I can't handle those for too long, as I get motion sick (also why I don't go on cruises - lol). I think the girls will have a great time, and I know that the slides will be a hit as well. I, of course, am looking forward to the swim-up bar and the spa.
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 04:30 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

karin, i agree with some of what you say. i do object to anyone bashing or putting down an area they haven't stayed at. they can't talk unless they have been there. just as i don't compare places i haven't been. it's just plain wrong. however, for those who have stayed in both areas, i see nothing wrong with them voicing opinions if asked by a newbie. i also see nothing wrong with you adding your opposing view to low rise lovers.

however, i have seen the same opinions constantly on other forums so i do object to anyone singling us out. all of us are wrong if we state biased opinions when we don't have a clue what we are talking about. that goes for any subject when we can seriously ruin a newbie's vacation by doing so.

i also see that many people are sensitive to this subject. maybe more so than needed on both sides of the issue. we all love what we love but we still need to remember that people are entitled to their opinions no matter how different they are than our own. something this foolish should not separate people when there are other bigger problems in this world.

now maybe i should start a thread on politics. there you would see some mild to wild comments and the bashing would never end, lol.

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Originally Posted by Karin View Post
I have to admit that I totally agree with what Weimaraner wrote. From the time I joined this board people would constantly (ok, I won't say bash) put down the hi rise area. I own at both the Ocean Club and Surf Club. I love the Marriott properties. I love Palm Beach. I would never post anything negative about the low rise area because I really don't care where other people stay. However, the people who do stay in the low rise are always the first to put down the hi rise. It's true, just go back and check previous posts. This has always irritated me. This is why I really don't have much to do with this board anymore.
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  #45  
Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 05:17 PM
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One Happy Island Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Here is my 2 cents. We have stayed at Rennasance, Divi village, CasaDelMar, Paradice Beach, Lacabana, Marriott Hotel, Ocean Club, and the Surf Club and my vote is for the Surf Club. I'm glad when people say to stay away from the Surf Club because its tooooo crowded. That leaves MORE room for MEEEEEEEE!!!! Ha! Ha! Kent
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 06:02 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Maybe because we like the quiet areas, I tend to overlook the posts about the high rises. Can someone please point out some of these 'high rise bashing' threads? Maybe I do it and don't know it - in which case, I need to know what I do so I can stop! I searched for a bit and can't find anything so I'm ready to be enlightened
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Old Sunday, February 22nd, 2009, 06:21 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Let me start by saying that I am a Low Riser (Meaning That I will only stay in the Low Rise area in Aruba). But other than that I don't see the need for me to bash those that stay in the High rise section. It's your money and you spend it any way you see fit.

We that choose the Low rise area have had our discussions about the New condos they are building in our section also. Oceania when that was 1st talked about we had our debates on that too.

The major problem seems to be that for some reason the gov't and maybe some people we don't know about seem to be making deals and their seems to be no discussion on the Enviromental impact on the area. because with building a new resort you also have to take into account all the inferstructure that goes with it. The traffic , congestion, Disposal of the waste and garbarge that those that stay in this New resort will produce. Plus it being a RC Do you Really think that the cilientle they are looking for the Upper class or Quote Rich would go to Aruba. Hell they go to St Barts where they can Park their Mega Yachts or they have Houses or Condos on the beach plus with this Global economic crisis those that once were rich are not ( See Bernie Madoff and his Ponzi scheme) plus they are trying to hang on to their money. It just seems like their were some under the table discussions where something was passed to get a quick positive response from the gov't to some investors which wanted this deal done.
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Last edited by Ron B; Monday, February 23rd, 2009 at 05:40 PM.
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  #48  
Old Monday, February 23rd, 2009, 12:32 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Come on guys - I personally don't care if you are a high or low riser - this issue here is that they are building on a site that has some environment and Arubian issues that are not being addressed:

1. Turtles
2. The queen granted the fisherman's huts - this is to pay tribute to the fishermen - that area is going to be "shortened"
3. Windsurfers will have their wind cut off
4. They are building into the selenas - which will prob. cause road flooding (think the Marriot has drainage problems HA) and will add to pollution.
The water that flows from the sea to the selenas will be impacted and
no study has been done on that.

So high risers and low risers unite on this. It doesn't matter if you want a quiet or active vacation. The point is that we love Aruba and this is just plain wrong!!!
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Old Monday, February 23rd, 2009, 12:49 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

bravo liz!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by lizzardo View Post
Come on guys - I personally don't care if you are a high or low riser - this issue here is that they are building on a site that has some environment and Arubian issues that are not being addressed:

1. Turtles
2. The queen granted the fisherman's huts - this is to pay tribute to the fishermen - that area is going to be "shortened"
3. Windsurfers will have their wind cut off
4. They are building into the selenas - which will prob. cause road flooding (think the Marriot has drainage problems HA) and will add to pollution.
The water that flows from the sea to the selenas will be impacted and
no study has been done on that.

So high risers and low risers unite on this. It doesn't matter if you want a quiet or active vacation. The point is that we love Aruba and this is just plain wrong!!!
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Old Monday, February 23rd, 2009, 05:19 PM
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Default Re: Ritz Carlton deal signed

Me, I like to stay at the Renaissance!

Seriously, I like the way that Aruba developed two distinctly different hotel districts. I certainly understand why some prefer one area while others prefer the other. Liz's post correctly articulates the real causes for concern with the Ritz project.
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