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Old Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010, 09:19 AM
normcor normcor is offline
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Default Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

I just read an article on arubabeaches.net that says palapas on Palm and Beach are free for the taking as long as you don't use the chairs that the hotels placed underneath. Does anyone know if there is any truth to this? You can read the article on http://www.arubabeaches.net/palapas-rules-and-rights/.
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Old Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010, 09:34 AM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

well, technically that isn't true. the beaches are free and open to all. therefore you can plop a chair, towel or umbrella of your own just about anywhere there is sand. however, the palapas and chairs are owned by the hotels. therefore, if the hotel staff asks you to move to make way for a resident, you are obligated to move. use of hotel and timeshare property is decided upon by the timeshare or hotel and the paying guests do have top billing.

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Originally Posted by normcor View Post
I just read an article on arubabeaches.net that says palapas on Palm and Beach are free for the taking as long as you don't use the chairs that the hotels placed underneath. Does anyone know if there is any truth to this? You can read the article on http://www.arubabeaches.net/palapas-rules-and-rights/.
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Old Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010, 10:43 AM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

i have asked our webmaster to find out the exact laws on this so that i can correct myself is i am wrong.

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Originally Posted by sherry View Post
well, technically that isn't true. the beaches are free and open to all. therefore you can plop a chair, towel or umbrella of your own just about anywhere there is sand. however, the palapas and chairs are owned by the hotels. therefore, if the hotel staff asks you to move to make way for a resident, you are obligated to move. use of hotel and timeshare property is decided upon by the timeshare or hotel and the paying guests do have top billing.
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Old Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010, 10:43 AM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

He's saying that this is illegal on the hotel's part. Here is what he wrote..."Resorts/Condos: You build the palapas illegally on public land/beach, universal usage is permitted by locals and tourists (of other hotels) without charge, without limit. You do not own the palapas, nor the beach. If you donít want others to use your beach chairs, donít park them under the palapas." Who am I supposed to believe?
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Old Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010, 11:09 AM
JohnJT JohnJT is offline
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

There are a few palapas along the beaches...like near Malmok and Boca Catalina.
I believe these were probably put there by the government...first come, first served.
We used them when we were snorkeling around there.

Up from Costa Linda, there are also some palapas...but I never knew for sure if they were put there (or maintained) by places like LaQuinta or Paradise Beach Villas or some other entity. We have seen groups of Arubans who seem to congregate near there for family outings...well, it just seems to me that they are not tourists.

At our resort, we do see people who are not members (identified by towel color) who camp out on the sand...not using the lounge chairs. Never saw them chased away. Doesn't mean it is right or wrong.

Edited to say: Looked at the article that recommends beach umbrellas versus palapas. We are about 5 miles from the ocean in Florida and have had two or more beach umbrellas wrecked by the breeze. Last week, we had gusts to 41 mph. Beach umbrellas in Aruba would not do well, IMHO.

Last edited by JohnJT; Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010 at 11:18 AM.
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Old Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010, 11:35 AM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

This is a very gray area and the laws are not clear on this.
However, it is my understanding and reading signs on
the beach - for example at the AM - it clearly states that
the hotels do not own the beaches, they are not responsible
for anything. If you build something on public property -
you can not own it.

I believe that some of the palapas that are really close to the
hotel might be hotel property. However the general 'rule of
thumb' and understanding is that a local can use a palapa
in front of a hotel as long as they do not use their chairs.

The hotels will try to tell people to leave but they really
do not have the law on their side. I know some locals
that have had that happen and told them to call the
police because what they were doing was legal. Everytime
the guards have backed down.

I have also seem attempts where the hotel chains a chair
to the palapas - not sure if this is a legal thing to do.

Like I said - there is no exact law. The department in charge
of this has allowed too many to be built w/o oversight. But
there have been articles that this matter will be addressed.
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Last edited by lizzardo; Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010 at 11:48 AM.
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Old Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010, 11:40 AM
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Smile Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

Yes the beaches are for everyone but I bet there is a law or guideline somewhere that defines where the free beach starts and where the hotel or timeshare property ends. Most likely something to do with high tide or meters from high tide. Most of the palapas I have seen at the resorts are above the high tide area by several meters and may well be the sole property and usage of the resort that put them there.

Last edited by dwippies; Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010 at 12:54 PM.
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Old Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010, 11:45 AM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

Arubans
have every right to use any beach they like regardless where.
All beaches are public. If you build on public property - it
doesn't mean you OWN it. I would build a beach house or hut on one if that were the truth!

Why not lay on a hotel beach? You can get a drink there. Really no reason is needed it is
owned by 'the people'....
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Last edited by dwippies; Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010 at 12:55 PM.
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Old Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010, 12:37 PM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

ok, honestly norm, i don't care what either he or i say, we will leave it to the experts who are going to give us proper answers. that will solve it. we can both tell what we believe to be the truth and both be wrong to some degree. that is why i suggested waiting instead of having an absolute from we who are doing educated guesswork.

Quote:
Originally Posted by normcor View Post
He's saying that this is illegal on the hotel's part. Here is what he wrote..."Resorts/Condos: You build the palapas illegally on public land/beach, universal usage is permitted by locals and tourists (of other hotels) without charge, without limit. You do not own the palapas, nor the beach. If you donít want others to use your beach chairs, donít park them under the palapas." Who am I supposed to believe?
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Old Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010, 02:30 PM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

ok, here is what i have found out.

1. some of the palapas were allowed because they were on long lease land considered part of the leased property to the resorts. however, at this point, in theory, normcor is right because

2. at the moment, all palapas not put up by the government are technically illegal. as such they can be used by anyone. however, what the resorts have been doing is placing chairs under them well before sunrise. since the chairs are actually owned by the resorts they are not supposed to be moved by anyone other than those associated with the resorts. however,

3. if a tourist or local not associated with the resort sits down under a palapa that has no chairs, they technically can't be asked to leave. but

4. the government will now be working on this from a zero point. they are going to check into the legality of the original long lease property lines and who is entitled to have what palapas and to whom they belong. until the matter is settled, they will remain public property.

the reason i keep using this 'technically' term is that although this is the way the law works, i don't know if it will work in reality. i am sure that the resorts that are charging ridiculous fees for public property to assure their possible illegal use by tourists may try putting pressure on any non resort people who are trying to use them. for that matter, people who are expecting to have a place to stay in the shade at any resort will be angry that someone not paying to stay is sitting in the shade and they are not. however, the local residents and any tourist not staying will also be angry.

therefore i urge the government to move quickly on this one. there has to be a way to give island residents the right to use 'public' beaches when and where they want but the tourists also need to have some rights at the resorts.
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Old Tuesday, March 23rd, 2010, 07:58 PM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

This is a very interesting topic. Thank you for researching the legality of our palapas (chickees). Elaine and I will be scrambling for 21 and 27 even more!!!
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Old Wednesday, March 24th, 2010, 09:07 AM
TomFrederick TomFrederick is offline
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I Love Aruba Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

Glad we go for our 2 weeks in the sun in June. Very slow month at my resort and walk down to the beach at 8am and have my pick of many front row huts.
>>> "check into the legality of the original long lease property lines and who is entitled to have what palapas"
---- So true. If you have walked around Bucuti and Manchebo like I have done since 1987 you will see where some of their property/buildings stick out further to the water than some of their huts. Also all along that area the coast line from Casa del Mar up to Costa Linda changes from year to year. So would like to know/see what is written about the property lines.

Last edited by TomFrederick; Wednesday, March 24th, 2010 at 09:21 AM.
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Old Wednesday, March 24th, 2010, 10:03 AM
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Smile Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

I know one thing I am not going to do while im on Aruba.

I am not going to waist my valuable time arguing with hotel/resort/security, police, at a resort im not staying at about whether I am legally allowed to use their palapas/facilities or not. Its a no win situation imho. There are usually plenty of palapas at the resorts we stay at.

I try not to be the ugly american when I visit other countries.
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Old Wednesday, March 24th, 2010, 10:37 AM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

bob, the problem is that as the hotels expand and actually take public beaches and cover them in palapas, the citizens of the island have fewer and fewer places to enjoy. i've been working with this 'say no to ritz' petition and i have learned a lot. the most popular beaches of residents are slowly but surely vanishing. their yearly easter time camp out is almost out of property. the beaches that were for families to sit and relax are covered with tourists, palapas, chairs, and guards who push the residents away from public areas telling them they are hotel property. if this was true than i could accept it and so would the residents who mostly earn a living by having tourism on the island. however, i am learning that the hotels overstepped their boundaries by large amounts. they plopped down palapas where free beach areas used to be and where they are illegal. the make it impossible for anyone but their customers to use by placing their own chairs there. no aruban would be rude enough to move a chair from under a palapa to sit on public sand on a public beach. i have heard complaints when residents have the 'audacity' to put towels and their own beach umbrellas up on a public beach. the complaint is 'the are ruining my view'. well, non aruban, you are stealing their public beach.

hopefully, now that the new government is involved there will be a speedy and equitable solution and that solution will become law. first they really need to get the hotels to stop charging tourists to sit on chairs that are on public property under palapas that are illegal. then they need to define the property lines. at which point the hotels should move the palapas behind the lines and actually spend the money they are making on the tourists to supply enough palapas between beach and pool to allow the tourists a place to sit in the shade. the nerve shown by these places offends me totally. they steal property from residents, they steal money from customers, they spend no money on improvement that help the customers or resident while spending money lining their own pockets. then they complain that the people legally on the beaches are blocking the view. a bit ballsy, wouldn't you say?

no tourist should ever have to stand in a line at 5 am to get a hut, nor should they ever have to pay for a hut when they are already paying far too much for the hotel room.

the translation of this is that everyone is getting royally screwed except the resorts themselves. the ceo's are laughing all the way to the bank. make all the money you want. i'm all for money, lol. just do it without destroying the lives of others. it's a simple process that most have forgotten.

Quote:
Originally Posted by arubabob View Post
I know one thing I am not going to do while im on Aruba.

I am not going to waist my valuable time arguing with hotel/resort/security, police, at a resort im not staying at about whether I am legally allowed to use their palapas/facilities or not. Its a no win situation imho. There are usually plenty of palapas at the resorts we stay at.

I try not to be the ugly american when I visit other countries.
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Old Wednesday, March 24th, 2010, 11:48 AM
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Smile Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

Quote:
Originally Posted by sherry View Post
bob, the problem is that as the hotels expand and actually take public beaches and cover them in palapas, the citizens of the island have fewer and fewer places to enjoy. i've been working with this 'say no to ritz' petition and i have learned a lot. the most popular beaches of residents are slowly but surely vanishing. their yearly easter time camp out is almost out of property. the beaches that were for families to sit and relax are covered with tourists, palapas, chairs, and guards who push the residents away from public areas telling them they are hotel property. if this was true than i could accept it and so would the residents who mostly earn a living by having tourism on the island. however, i am learning that the hotels overstepped their boundaries by large amounts. they plopped down palapas where free beach areas used to be and where they are illegal. the make it impossible for anyone but their customers to use by placing their own chairs there. no aruban would be rude enough to move a chair from under a palapa to sit on public sand on a public beach. i have heard complaints when residents have the 'audacity' to put towels and their own beach umbrellas up on a public beach. the complaint is 'the are ruining my view'. well, non aruban, you are stealing their public beach.

hopefully, now that the new government is involved there will be a speedy and equitable solution and that solution will become law. first they really need to get the hotels to stop charging tourists to sit on chairs that are on public property under palapas that are illegal. then they need to define the property lines. at which point the hotels should move the palapas behind the lines and actually spend the money they are making on the tourists to supply enough palapas between beach and pool to allow the tourists a place to sit in the shade. the nerve shown by these places offends me totally. they steal property from residents, they steal money from customers, they spend no money on improvement that help the customers or resident while spending money lining their own pockets. then they complain that the people legally on the beaches are blocking the view. a bit ballsy, wouldn't you say?

no tourist should ever have to stand in a line at 5 am to get a hut, nor should they ever have to pay for a hut when they are already paying far too much for the hotel room.

the translation of this is that everyone is getting royally screwed except the resorts themselves. the ceo's are laughing all the way to the bank. make all the money you want. i'm all for money, lol. just do it without destroying the lives of others. it's a simple process that most have forgotten.
I think that is terrible. The Aruban government should stand up for their own over the big hotels. They are not going to close their doors if the govrnment enforces the laws. Lets see if the new government will stand up for the people. If hotels are doing illegal exspansion it is the governments job to stop it. Isnt that why the Aruban people elect them? As far as the Easter campout is concerned, if you are correct about the palapas being illegaly erected in that area, if I was an Aruban citizen, I would simply take a group of people and remove the ones that were in the way.
An easier solution would be for the government to simply fine each hotel $100 a day for each palapa they claim as their own until they either put a sign on it that states: This palapa is for public use., or removes it.

On another note, as a 13 time visitor to Aruba, I want you all to know I have never gotten in line, at any time of day, to get a palapa. I also have never been up at 5 am on Aruba. I have never paid for a palapa either. I would drive into town and buy a beach umbrella before I would pay a fee for one.
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Old Wednesday, March 24th, 2010, 12:16 PM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

Sherry
Agree with you on all counts, but need to add that if tourists would stop SAVING palapas that they don't occupy for 90 percent of the day, maybe there would be shade for all. And shade is necessary for almost all tourists.
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Old Wednesday, March 24th, 2010, 12:17 PM
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I Love Aruba Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

Quote:
Originally Posted by arubabob View Post
I think that is terrible. The Aruban government should stand up for their own over the big hotels. They are not going to close their doors if the govrnment enforces the laws. Lets see if the new government will stand up for the people. If hotels are doing illegal exspansion it is the governments job to stop it. Isnt that why the Aruban people elect them? As far as the Easter campout is concerned, if you are correct about the palapas being illegaly erected in that area, if I was an Aruban citizen, I would simply take a group of people and remove the ones that were in the way.
An easier solution would be for the government to simply fine each hotel $100 a day for each palapa they claim as their own until they either put a sign on it that states: This palapa is for public use., or removes it.

On another note, as a 13 time visitor to Aruba, I want you all to know I have never gotten in line, at any time of day, to get a palapa. I also have never been up at 5 am on Aruba. I have never paid for a palapa either. I would drive into town and buy a beach umbrella before I would pay a fee for one.
In February I watched a couple putting up a beach umbrella in the sand. Within minutes, as soon as the wind kicked in, that umbrella became a flying missle. Fortunately, it was stopped by a wall, but if it had hit someone, it could have caused very serious injuries.
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Old Wednesday, March 24th, 2010, 01:16 PM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

bob and philly,

i agree with both of you. and may i add that if a day comes that i would have to pay or stand in line for a palapa i would drive to another beach or pick another island no matter how much i love aruba.

sadly, it isn't arubans doing it. it is the big corporations that don't give a damned, plop a hotel in the middle of an island and ignore the requirements of residents as well as tourists.
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Old Wednesday, March 24th, 2010, 04:43 PM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

At the Marriott, Surf Club and Ocean Club, if you want a front Palapa they, that is MARRIOTT charges US$20. Are they in fact charging for something illegally??

Bill
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Old Wednesday, March 24th, 2010, 05:56 PM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

honestly bill, i don't know. the government will be studying exactly where the long lease land (say that fast a few times, lol) ends and the public beach begins. until then i would imagine marriott can charge you anything they want.

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At the Marriott, Surf Club and Ocean Club, if you want a front Palapa they, that is MARRIOTT charges US$20. Are they in fact charging for something illegally??

Bill
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Old Wednesday, March 24th, 2010, 06:15 PM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

I will say that the Marriott's started charging for the palapas as a way to be fair to all it's guests. As we all know..some people think they are more entitled to the best of everything...therefore....they felt by charging a fee..and changing the rotation every 3 or so days for the front row... that any and all patrons that absolutely had to have the front row would have a fair chance...and many are willing to do so.As far as illegal...don't know. I and my husband never pay for a palapa...we take a 2nd or 3rd row and are just as happy. My hubby goes around 7:30 and it's always fine. We do know some people that get the same palapa each and every day (free ones that is)...but they get up and go down early and are usually the first in line.And our towel huts don't open until 7:00 a m anyway. And as your stay goes on...people sort of get the same ones and you start to learn who goes where. Just happy to be in Aruba and don't really let these things rile me up. But I will say that I don't want any resident to be without because of me. I am on THEIR island....I am a guest there...and I don't have any right to deny them their space. JMHO
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Old Wednesday, March 24th, 2010, 07:21 PM
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Default Re: Palapas on Palm and Eagle Beach

i totally agree that i would never take away from the residents but i tend to disagree on the marriott charging. it just means that the guy with the money gets the front seat. considering that a vacation is already expensive and marriott is not running at a loss anymore than any of the others really are, i would suggest that they do it for free and with an easy system.

each day a specific set of rooms, assigned the same every week, get the front row. same with the second and third rows. make sure there are enough in each row for the amount of rooms. it's an easy process. charging people for the front row in my opinion is offensive and insulting to those who happen to have to set a strict budget in order to travel. put the list up in each room. no one can complain that it is unfair. it's an easy process.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ruba4ever View Post
I will say that the Marriott's started charging for the palapas as a way to be fair to all it's guests. As we all know..some people think they are more entitled to the best of everything...therefore....they felt by charging a fee..and changing the rotation every 3 or so days for the front row... that any and all patrons that absolutely had to have the front row would have a fair chance...and many are willing to do so.As far as illegal...don't know. I and my husband never pay for a palapa...we take a 2nd or 3rd row and are just as happy. My hubby goes around 7:30 and it's always fine. We do know some people that get the same palapa each and every day (free ones that is)...but they get up and go down early and are usually the first in line.And our towel huts don't open until 7:00 a m anyway. And as your stay goes on...people sort of get the same ones and you start to learn who goes where. Just happy to be in Aruba and don't really let these things rile me up. But I will say that I don't want any resident to be without because of me. I am on THEIR island....I am a guest there...and I don't have any right to deny them their space. JMHO
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